Modern Black Metal (and its factionalism)

[DeathfareDevil]

Since the "Now Playing" thread is meandering a bit, I figured I'd try to bring a certain tangent of it to this thread.

Black metal, unlike death metal, seems to have been comprised of warring factions since the mid-Nineties or so. Explanations usually come in the manichean form of "orthodox black metal versus every other kind," but it's more complicated than that. If you're privy to the rumblings of dissent at ANUS.com (something I don't necessarily recommend), you'll know that The Fall occurred with the release of The Abyss' The Other Side, a good if formulaic album created by death metal musicians. Others cite the division between the more "gothic" black metal bands (Dimmu Borgir, Cradle of Filth) and bands able to limit the size of their audience by maintaining a more antagonistic sound. Whatever the case, this dialogue -- certainly its intensity -- seems unique to the black metal subgenre. Thus I'm interested in what this board has to say about it.

How do you like your black metal? Does philosophy color your appreciation of the music, or are you able to enjoy everything from Blut Aus Nord to Glorior Belli to Darkthrone to the aforementioned Dimmu Borgir? Do you prefer experimentalism or the stricter forms of the genre?

Personally I like just about all the black metal I've ever heard except for the "Dimmu" bands (Old Man's Child, Tidfall, Thy Serpent, and whoever else). It's not the use of keyboards that turns me off; it's the seemingly whimsical arrangements: cramming too many parts within a song, leaving the guitars to a supporting role, forcing musical climaxes in the manner of a John Williams soundtrack. My favorite band is Darkthrone, though I have to add that they may be the most misunderstood band in black metal -- their albums have been far more varied, one from the other, than Metal Journalism 101 suggests. Also in my pantheon are Immortal, Carpathian Forest, Nagelfar, Leviathan, Rotting Christ (for maybe 50% of their output), and of course Emperor, whose two mid-Nineties albums rank in my book next to the symphonies of Beethoven and the operas of Wagner.

So enough of my blather. Consider this an open thread for the sake of praising, complaining about, or passing any other kind of judgment on black metal in its modern form.

[Brian]

I'm not really a fan of the "Dimmu" bands, as you called them, but I actually really enjoy Dimmu. Death Cult Armageddon was fucking awful in my opinion, but everything else they've released has been pretty enjoyable. I also enjoy Old Man's Child, but that's about it for the widdly keyboard-heavy black metal.

The LLN stuff was pretty cool and I really think that France is the number 1 country for black metal right now. So much creativity and experimentation.

I'm also a big fan of USBM and of course the early 90s Scandinavian stuff.

Even stuff like Wold has been pretty interesting to my ears lately (thanks Mitch!)

[jswift]

I would say that black metal has become a parody of itself, but in reality, it's always been a parody, from the cheesy salvo of Venom "...and offer your souls to the gods of rock and roll!" to the modern day absurdity of Gorgoroth and their sundry exploits. I think black metal enthusiasts would greatly benefit from taking a few steps back and realizing that the music the so direly and fervantly "fight" for is inherently ridiculous.

Yeah, I dig Emperor and Mayhem, too, but the entire structure, the base of which their music is built upon, is completely and utterly silly.

Long story short: Relax, don't take your preferred genre of music that seriously and never forget: 99 percent of all "br00tal kvlt" BM loyalists will never embark from the frigid bleakness of their parents' basement.

[MS_39455]

Most of the music purchases that I've made over the last few years have been funneled through The Ajna Offensive, Southern Lord, and the like. I can state only that I feel like I've been listening to something that is in my opinion relatively fresh. I support a certain amount of experimentation.

I can agree that France is an area of the world currently at the forefront of black metal, but with particular emphasis on the Norma Evangelium Diabol label. I think that being the in-house distro for Deathspell Omega has allowed them to dredge up some pretty cool stuff from all over Europe: Katharsis, Mortuus, Funeral Mist, just to name a few.

To answer the question, I feel that a sound, rather than a philosophy or agenda is able to determine for me what my listening preferences are. I can identify much closer to the sounds of Ondskapt, Temple of Baal, or even Marduk than I can with the so called "Dimmu bands."

I dig lots of serious metal, but there's some intangible draw that black metal and its many incarnations continues to exude that keeps my attention more than any other subgenre. That's my brief and elementary take on it.

[ScreamBloodyGore]

Any band that advocates Socialism and creates a decent atmosphere is ok with me.

[Blarg!]

I would say that black metal has become a parody of itself, but in reality, it's always been a parody, from the cheesy salvo of Venom "...and offer your souls to the gods of rock and roll!" to the modern day absurdity of Gorgoroth and their sundry exploits. I think black metal enthusiasts would greatly benefit from taking a few steps back and realizing that the music the so direly and fervantly "fight" for is inherently ridiculous.

Yeah, I dig Emperor and Mayhem, too, but the entire structure, the base of which their music is built upon, is completely and utterly silly.

Long story short: Relax, don't take your preferred genre of music that seriously and never forget: 99 percent of all "br00tal kvlt" BM loyalists will never embark from the frigid bleakness of their parents' basement.

...Uneducated
Judging by this post, your only study of black metal is off of myspace and through other people who dislike it.

By the way... you used "Kvlt"..This post is automatically failure.

[DeathfareDevil]

By the way, I don't wish to seem like a snob with a knee-jerk aversion to Dimmu Borgir and others of its kind. My main concern is songwriting, and, frankly, those sorts of bands never seem able to construct a good song. "Mourning Palace" was great, but I've not heard anything reaching its level in the ensuing decade. (And it's probably no coincidence that it was one of Dimmu's simplest tracks.) Several Old Man's Child songs I've heard on WREKage (c/o Paul) will have one or two cool parts, but never anything holding those parts together. The last OMC song I wholly liked was "Christian Death." It was on Born of the Flickering. That was some time ago.

All this isn't to say that I prefer simplicity. But if a song is going to be a massive, Byzantine mess (in a good way), it has to be put together by someone with a gift for fluidity -- Ihsahn tops this list, undoubtedly. (Whoever writes most of Anata's stuff is in this category as well.)



Continuing, I would be very interested in hearing more of the connection between jazz and black metal. I think this was brought up vis a vis Deathspell Omega's work. All I've heard from them is Kenose -- which I fucking love -- but my limited exposure to jazz -- limited because I tried then failed to get into it -- prevents me from hearing any connection between these two disparate styles of music.

[stalindrummer]

Continuing, I would be very interested in hearing more of the connection between jazz and black metal. I think this was brought up vis a vis Deathspell Omega's work. All I've heard from them is Kenose -- which I fucking love -- but my limited exposure to jazz -- limited because I tried then failed to get into it -- prevents me from hearing any connection between these two disparate styles of music.

There is no connection between Jazz and black metal.........


p.s. KVLT

[Kurt]

Black Metal is about creating a specific atmosphere. This atmosphere should be conveyed 100% from every aspect of the work in question. Every drum beat, every note, every lyrical piece, every graphic image, every photo, and all other aspects of the work should be scrutinized to the millionth degree.

Does it, or does it not convey a proper atmosphere?

Of course, in the 80s bands like Bathory, Venom, Celtic Frost et cetera took the tools that they had and created the most evil sounds that they were capable of. Since then, musicians have taken it well beyond what was capable or conceivable at the time. The punk rock influence in the aforementioned bands cannot be denied and said bands deserve every bit of reverence that they receive.

However, the punk rock influence in Black Metal was phased out by bands as they progressed into new realms and the atmosphere moved away from the profane sounds of the earliest Black Metal bands into something far more, well, atmospheric.

So, to come back to the initial question proposed in this thread, I like my Black Metal sans-as much "heavy metal" as possible.

Examples of "how I like my Black metal": Some old, some new.

Archgoat, Demoncy, Crimson Moon, Beherit (Drawing Down the Moon is the best Black Metal album ever), Black Dawn, Dark Funeral (Vobiscum Sathanas only), Animus Mortis, Mefitic, Nocternity, Antaeus, Graveland, Fullmoon, Veles, Strid, Negura Bunget, Tenebrous, Nyktalgia's first album, Borknagar's first album, Ulver (Nattens Madrigal), old Black Funeral, Blasphemy, Abyssic Hate, Hell Militia, Judas Iscariot, Nastrond, VON.

[MikeLindgren]

It gets no more black metal than the Spice Girls:

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In case you didn't know, they are TOTALLY agents of Satan.

Hail Posh Spice for that righteously unholy ass.

[Brian]

Lots of cool bands on that list Kurt but a whole lot I've never heard of. I'll be checking those out, thanks for all the recommendations.

[Blarg!]

Black Metal is about creating a specific atmosphere. This atmosphere should be conveyed 100% from every aspect of the work in question. Every drum beat, every note, every lyrical piece, every graphic image, every photo, and all other aspects of the work should be scrutinized to the millionth degree.

Does it, or does it not convey a proper atmosphere?

Of course, in the 80s bands like Bathory, Venom, Celtic Frost et cetera took the tools that they had and created the most evil sounds that they were capable of. Since then, musicians have taken it well beyond what was capable or conceivable at the time. The punk rock influence in the aforementioned bands cannot be denied and said bands deserve every bit of reverence that they receive.

However, the punk rock influence in Black Metal was phased out by bands as they progressed into new realms and the atmosphere moved away from the profane sounds of the earliest Black Metal bands into something far more, well, atmospheric.

So, to come back to the initial question proposed in this thread, I like my Black Metal sans-as much "heavy metal" as possible.

Examples of "how I like my Black metal": Some old, some new.

Archgoat, Demoncy, Crimson Moon, Beherit (Drawing Down the Moon is the best Black Metal album ever), Black Dawn, Dark Funeral (Vobiscum Sathanas only), Animus Mortis, Mefitic, Nocternity, Antaeus, Graveland, Fullmoon, Veles, Strid, Negura Bunget, Tenebrous, Nyktalgia's first album, Borknagar's first album, Ulver (Nattens Madrigal), old Black Funeral, Blasphemy, Abyssic Hate, Hell Militia, Judas Iscariot, Nastrond, VON.

Nevermind..forget trying to explain anything on metalforums.

[Brian]

People who subscribe to the black metal lifestyle are cool and all. I have no problems with anyone choosing any subculture of anything to live in.

But isn't black metal one big sausage fest?

[Blarg!]

People who subscribe to the black metal lifestyle are cool and all. I have no problems with anyone choosing any subculture of anything to live in.

But isn't black metal one big sausage fest?

There are some all-women black metal bands.
But as for that..Most people I know have pretty normal girlfriends/wifes.

[Brian]

People who subscribe to the black metal lifestyle are cool and all. I have no problems with anyone choosing any subculture of anything to live in.

But isn't black metal one big sausage fest?

There are some all-women black metal bands.
But as for that..Most people I know have pretty normal girlfriends/wifes.

Well yeah I figured that black metallers have normal significant others. Really all I want to do is find an attractive girl who is into Carpathian Forest.