Is black metal hip enough yet?

theRothstanator · Post by **theRothstanator** » Tue October 18th, 2011, 3:12 pm

Knucklehead wrote:
Holiday Rambler wrote:How do individuals in a crowd really ruin a show for people? There is no greater indication that one is not really there to hear music if other attendees standing in various parts of the same room "ruin" your evening.
Well, I was watching 1349 (?) play in Hell when some skins were slamming in the pit. One of them got thrown out, for some reason and the other randomly slugged the guy standing next to me in the face. It sort of put a damper on the whole thing.

Yeah, I don't really care if people are just there or whatever but it pisses me off when people from outside come in and fuck shit up! Or they come in and are just straight up doing it wrong-- moshing at a black metal show wtf.

relapse · Post by **relapse** » Tue October 18th, 2011, 3:49 pm

theRothstanator wrote:moshing at a black metal show wtf.

this, all my rage

Post by **Metalfreak** » Tue October 18th, 2011, 4:23 pm

Knucklehead wrote:
Holiday Rambler wrote:How do individuals in a crowd really ruin a show for people? There is no greater indication that one is not really there to hear music if other attendees standing in various parts of the same room "ruin" your evening.
Well, I was watching 1349 (?) play in Hell when some skins were slamming in the pit. One of them got thrown out, for some reason and the other randomly slugged the guy standing next to me in the face. It sort of put a damper on the whole thing.

lol this is from the thread about the scion show:

Metalfreak wrote:My b/f was involved with that whole affair...he wasn't the one who was fighting or punching but what he said was that 2 hardcore assholes came into the pit and started moshing hardcore style and that was when people were complaining about the moshing because it wasn't regular moshing, it was more violent. Those two guys were trying to start shit. Then I guess things got heated and one of the hardcore dudes punched some guy so my b/f grabbed the guy who threw the punch in a full-nelson so he wouldn't punch anyone else. Then that guy got thrown out.

and it gets even better than that...yep, they were skins like you said and less than a year later one of my friends gets a new boyfriend. They come over to my place to hang out and the Scion show came up (my friend and her then b/f like metal too) and of course that fight came up. Lo and behold it turns out my friend's now ex-boyfriend was the one who got thrown out and that my boyfriend was the one who put him in the full-nelson

Yeah that made for an interesting conversation!

People can be fucking idiots.

As far as people wearing whatever to metal shows, I could give two shits about what they're wearing. As long as they're not causing trouble then who gives a fuck? Yeah it's pretty obvious when you see a hipster and they do dress retarded but I don't care if they choose to go to a metal show as long as they don't cause trouble.

relapse wrote:
theRothstanator wrote:moshing at a black metal show wtf.
this, all my rage

if it's faster paced like Emperor or something then I'm all for moshing at a black metal show! Something like WITTR then no...it's too slow for that lol

Holiday Rambler · Post by **Holiday Rambler** » Tue October 18th, 2011, 6:22 pm

SlashAndThrash wrote:
Holiday Rambler wrote:How do individuals in a crowd really ruin a show for people? There is no greater indication that one is not really there to hear music if other attendees standing in various parts of the same room "ruin" your evening.
i mean that's cool, if you want to try to call me out or something, i understand you're in wizard smoke and you are used to dealing almost exclusively with hipsters so you prpbably don't really understand where i'm coming from. I had a fucking blast at our show at jacks but there were still the hipsters who turned out to crowd the place, break the window to the outside, and generally bring down levels of fun all around. Not being repulsed by hipsters is no greater indication that you don't really care about the existence of a metal scene imo.

Breaking shit and being an asshole is different than being "repulsed" by your perception of what clique a person belongs to, or someone not meeting your minimum threshold of overt "metal" appearance. Do certain races "repulse" you as well? Sounds harsh probably, but that's the logical path you're going down. You feel physically sick by the LOOK of certain people showing up to watch your band? That's pathetic.

If those same "hipsters" were longhairs, wearing jeans and Dyssrhymmthic Asssyrthgorth tees, would you be griping about it? Just wondering, because it sounds like your interests lie in establishing rules for playing dress-up rather than making/listening to music.

GameFreac · Post by **GameFreac** » Tue October 18th, 2011, 9:01 pm

Holiday Rambler wrote:
SlashAndThrash wrote:
Holiday Rambler wrote:How do individuals in a crowd really ruin a show for people? There is no greater indication that one is not really there to hear music if other attendees standing in various parts of the same room "ruin" your evening.
i mean that's cool, if you want to try to call me out or something, i understand you're in wizard smoke and you are used to dealing almost exclusively with hipsters so you prpbably don't really understand where i'm coming from. I had a fucking blast at our show at jacks but there were still the hipsters who turned out to crowd the place, break the window to the outside, and generally bring down levels of fun all around. Not being repulsed by hipsters is no greater indication that you don't really care about the existence of a metal scene imo.
Breaking shit and being an asshole is different than being "repulsed" by your perception of what clique a person belongs to, or someone not meeting your minimum threshold of overt "metal" appearance. Do certain races "repulse" you as well? Sounds harsh probably, but that's the logical path you're going down. You feel physically sick by the LOOK of certain people showing up to watch your band? That's pathetic.

If those same "hipsters" were longhairs, wearing jeans and Dyssrhymmthic Asssyrthgorth tees, would you be griping about it? Just wondering, because it sounds like your interests lie in establishing rules for playing dress-up rather than making/listening to music.

Seriously...I feel like people hating hipsters is like people hating certain cliques in high school.

SlashAndThrash · Post by **SlashAndThrash** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 4:02 am

Holiday Rambler wrote:
SlashAndThrash wrote:
Holiday Rambler wrote:How do individuals in a crowd really ruin a show for people? There is no greater indication that one is not really there to hear music if other attendees standing in various parts of the same room "ruin" your evening.
i mean that's cool, if you want to try to call me out or something, i understand you're in wizard smoke and you are used to dealing almost exclusively with hipsters so you prpbably don't really understand where i'm coming from. I had a fucking blast at our show at jacks but there were still the hipsters who turned out to crowd the place, break the window to the outside, and generally bring down levels of fun all around. Not being repulsed by hipsters is no greater indication that you don't really care about the existence of a metal scene imo.

Breaking shit and being an asshole is different than being "repulsed" by your perception of what clique a person belongs to, or someone not meeting your minimum threshold of overt "metal" appearance. Do certain races "repulse" you as well? Sounds harsh probably, but that's the logical path you're going down. You feel physically sick by the LOOK of certain people showing up to watch your band? That's pathetic.

you're the one fixating on appearance here. the correlation you've drawn between hating other races and hating hipsters is the most absurd and asinine thing i've ever heard in my life. Sorry, when I see a hipster, I see someone dumb and vapid enough to buy in to a culture that thrives on watering down other cultures, misunderstanding it, exploiting it, and ultimately abandoning it, not just mustaches and glasses. When you see people of other races, is all you see skin color? i can turn that right around back at you, pal. Any part of this conversation past this point, i'm not even going to dignify with a response.

Holiday Rambler wrote:If those same "hipsters" were longhairs, wearing jeans and Dyssrhymmthic Asssyrthgorth tees, would you be griping about it? Just wondering, because it sounds like your interests lie in establishing rules for playing dress-up rather than making/listening to music.

If they were hipsters, than yeah, fuck them. I see and know plenty of hipsters disguised as metalheads. And none of them are worth a shit. It takes a lot more than a look to not be a douchebag. Don't even begin to question my integrity as a fan, or as a musician. If i dedicate my life to doing something, my interests lie in defending it. Does that somehow discredit what I'm doing initially? I don't care what the hell someone does, i dont care if fucking reverend run were at my show going apeshit, i don't care if you have a shaved head or ten feet of hair, a beard or a fucking tree branch growing out of your head, if you're there for the music and because you love it. Sorry, but hipsters simply are never there for that reason. Hipsters are not just a look and a clique, they are a direct result of a superiority complex layered on top of an inability to identify ones own self, And they are not just some clique standing around like in high school, because they fuck everything up, which i believe is kind of the reason this thread even exists. They are window shoppers, they are gawkers and high-and-mighty shit-talkers who open their mouths and praise or degrade something before they even fully grasp the concept. They've taken over media outlets and promote garbage while they obliviously slander killer shit (Decibel recently calling Inquisition "Grim metal clowns" comes to mind, I'm not personally the biggest fan but OH YEAH, I'm sure that's really gonna help the scene and help attract positive attention). They actively poison anything they flock to. A crowd full of hipsters is like a food product stuffed full of MSG. It fattens it up, it fills a concert hall, but at the end of the day its just extra artificial bullshit that's actually pretty harmful.If you want to sit here and try to cut me down for being a purist, that's just fine (albeit a complete and sad waste of your time), but it sounds to me like you're just kind of butthurt that I have a strong opinion about something, and you should really get the fuck off my back. Hipsters have nothing to do with metal as far as I'm concerned. If they piss me off, what's it to you? If long hair and metal Ts are "dress up" to you, that's on you and your friends and how you and they go about your respective business. I'm not blind, I go to shows, I know what I see and I personally know a fucking LOT of the people I'm referring to, and I take nothing back. I'm not speaking while uninformed, and my hatred isn't bred from ignorance. If you have a problem with what I said, you need to take a seat, there's work to be done

Holiday Rambler · Post by **Holiday Rambler** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 9:42 am

What's asinine is that you act like these people have "HIPSTER" tattooed on their forehead, or that you have some insight into a person's belief system and motivation for getting out of bed every day simply by eyeballing them. That's not me fixating on appearances, that's you.

You should consider forming a task force. Stand outside clubs with a few like-minded buddies and, Buckhead dance club-style, determine who is fit to enter and who can fuck off.

"Welcome."
"Welcome."
"NOT YOU, FUCKO. YOU HAVE A MOUSTACHE. YOU'RE THE MOST VILE DISTILLATION OF EMPTY CULTURAL POSTURING AND SUBSTANCE-SUCKING POSEURDOM IMAGINABLE. I HAVE A GOOD MIND TO PHYSICALLY KILL YOU AND SEVEN GENERATIONS OF YOUR PROGENY."
"Enjoy the show."
"Big tits, you're in."
"WHOA WHOA WHOA..."

Harboring a lot of image-based anger and promoting a bullshit theatre of exclusivity is surely a solid way to build a killer scene, bro. It's the reason Buckhead is so fucking awesome seven nights a week.

"SUP Y'ALL, CAN'T BELIEVE WE MADE THE CUT!"

"Y'ALL READY FOR SOME BLAST BEATS HERE AT JACK'S PIZZA! I'M RICK JAMES, BITCH! ANYONE WANNA PLAY BEER-PONG???"

Mangled · Post by **Mangled** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 11:40 am

dude if you can't recognize a hipster when you see one thats a problem. Its more than just the image. its their thought process and the fact that they're not at a show for the music (and if they are it is most likely not the MAIN reason they're there). Its a social statement, its making an appearance. I feel like your playing devils advocate here, because someone who loves metal and playing music like im sure you do, doesn't wanna tolerate someone making a mockery (to a degree) of what you love.

SlashAndThrash · Post by **SlashAndThrash** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 11:51 am

seriously, always with appearance. If you can't tell a hipster by anything other than looks then it isn't my problem. Its not image based, its literally what they all do, and i could accept someone viewing that as a sweeping generalization if it wasn't for the fact that i've never, ever been shown any reason to believe otherwise. its like you either ignored everything i said or just straight up didn't read anything i said past me calling your asinine argument asinine. If you want to keep playing devils advocate thats fine but all i really see is "BLAH BLAH BLAH BLaH HIPSTERS ARE FINE WITH ME", and that's fine, but I don't have to subscribe to your beliefs just like i'm not hounding anyone else on here to adhere to mine. you're obviously a pretty funny guy and seriously im not trying to fight and i don't have a problem with you at all, so i reiterate, get the fuck off my back champ, nothings changing any time soon so there will still be plenty of folks in the crowd at your shows. and in the mean time i'll continue not really giving a fuck what you have to say about what i think.

Holiday Rambler · Post by **Holiday Rambler** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 12:05 pm

Mangled wrote:dude if you can't recognize a hipster when you see one thats a problem. Its more than just the image.

I guess I can't, probably because I've seen everything from homeless Freegans to fixie-riding bartenders to young businesspeople on MARTA wearing glasses described as "hipsters." It's a meaningless catch-all term for "PEOPLE LESS COOL THAN ME" that was "scenester" a few years ago and "emo kids" before that and "nu-metal douches" before that (ok, that one is fair.)

Mangled wrote:its their thought process and the fact that they're not at a show for the music (and if they are it is most likely not the MAIN reason they're there). Its a social statement, its making an appearance.

So you and your buddy SlashAndThrash are fuckin' mind readers? Or just so wise to social construction that you can guess a person's intentions by a manner of appearance? Interesting. Also, totally goddammed retarded.

You two aren't judging individuals on individual behavior, you're grouping different people with different ideas and different tastes and different motivations into one faction because you need some boogeyman "other" on which to dispense your internet/scene rage.

And I'm not trying to get on your back, sorry if I'm stabbing a sacred cow or whatever. I'm simply stating that I think your attitude is divisive and damaging to your band, the other bands out there performing for anyone interested in listening, and to the music community in general.

Alas, anger makes the best metal. So carry on.

SlashAndThrash · Post by **SlashAndThrash** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 12:17 pm

Holiday Rambler wrote:
And I'm not trying to get on your back, sorry if I'm stabbing a sacred cow or whatever. I'm simply stating that I think your attitude is divisive and damaging to your band, the other bands out there performing for anyone interested in listening, and to the music community in general.

Alas, anger makes the best metal. So carry on.

sorry, but i'm not exactly burning issues of Vice on stage and calling for the active smashing of all glasses and lightweight bicycle frames while goose stepping my way through a song. I'm venting on a forum. a metal forum. full of metal heads. a lot of whom are my friends. the fact that what i think in private and outside of a place where hipsters would even be aware of what i'm saying has evoked any response at all is stupid, and i hardly think some (initially) humorous ranting, far away from the prying ears of the hip community, is damaging to anyone other than folks taking it too serious to begin with.

EDIT: also you're being an aggressively confrontational dick which is the exact opposite of "simply stating" ANYTHING, just saying.

Holiday Rambler · Post by **Holiday Rambler** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 12:55 pm

I wonder if a "fixie" can be backpedaled that hard.

SlashAndThrash · Post by **SlashAndThrash** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 1:08 pm

alright i was going to just forget about all this, but you are a fucking idiot man, and the reason you can't see what i'm talking about or have a problem with it is because your entire band is made up of fucking hipsters, this isn't a secret, and i'm definitely far from the first one to make this claim. even people who like your band say this about you. I even like your band, a lot, and know this to be true. I tried to get as civil as i could with it but you're just throwing gas on the fire. INCOMING U DONT KNOW ME OR ANYONE IN MY BAND STFU well dude how about YOU just shut the fuck up. I've honestly shut you down regarding pretty much everything you have had to say thus far and you still keep going.

Holiday Rambler · Post by **Holiday Rambler** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 1:09 pm

SlashAndThrash wrote:EDIT: also you're being an aggressively confrontational dick which is the exact opposite of "simply stating" ANYTHING, just saying.

Bro, this is not confrontation. You spewed extreme venom about something. I think you're retarded for it. This is the internet. These things happen all the time.

Holiday Rambler · Post by **Holiday Rambler** » Wed October 19th, 2011, 1:15 pm

SlashAndThrash wrote:alright i was going to just forget about all this, but you are a fucking idiot man, and the reason you can't see what i'm talking about or have a problem with it is because your entire band is made up of fucking hipsters, this isn't a secret, and i'm definitely far from the first one to make this claim. even people who like your band say this about you. I even like your band, a lot, and know this to be true. I tried to get as civil as i could with it but you're just throwing gas on the fire. INCOMING U DONT KNOW ME OR ANYONE IN MY BAND STFU well dude how about YOU just shut the fuck up. I've honestly shut you down regarding pretty much everything you have had to say thus far and you still keep going.

"OH GOD IT WAS AWFUL, THEN HE REVEALED THAT I WAS IN FACT A HIPSTER! IT WAS WORSE THAN THE TIME I FOUND OUT I HAD AIDS."

I'm aware that people call us hipsters. I just don't care. No one in my band cares either, because we're all adults and realize that pissing contests designed to categorize people as "THIS" or "THAT" is a waste of time and has abso-fucking-lutely nothing to do with music. I hope you and your friends get there one day.

AtlantaMetal

Is black metal hip enough yet?

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