American support of Israel.

[lifesadream]

So if it had been CNN it would be a different story bro? See thats the problem with people like you the facts are there but you refuse to listen.

No, because if CNN had reported it, it would have been major news across all spectrums of the media. They aren't perfect, but they don't have a quarter of the agenda the FOX has. The work they do also resembles something called "journalism" you may have heard about, unlike your pals Shepard Smith & co.

Read up sometime:

http://newsbyus.com/more.php?id=4515_0_1_0_M
http://www.politicalcortex.com/story/20 ... 192926/671
http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/ ... for_itself

Right on man. Fox has been caught lying so many times its too hard to count and the fact that they have been paid by the Bush Administration to lie is even sadder and has been already proven from independent researchers who look for truth in Media. Watch the documentary Outfoxed. pretty much says it all.

[Holiday Rambler]

http://www.internet-grocer.net/weapons.htm

April 6, 2006.

So FOX news has the smoking gun evidence to rub in every Bush-basher and war-detractor in the world's face, and it waits two-and-a-half months to reveal it?

Interesting!

[Death2all]

And everything that you have stated here are all facts that can be backed up. If that is the case then start posting your resources that have kind of credit.

that all has been proven to be false. We all know no wmd's have been found. The President has even said that no WMD's have been found, so that link that you just posted is full of misinformation. Its run by a Neo-Con group out to discredit people who have already exposed the truth. I cant believe you try to use that as any kind of proof of what you are trying to prove. Thats almost sad.

The US funded and Trained Al Qaeda The Bush family did business with the Taliban for years and have had Taliban leaders in Texas when Bush was Governor there.
Bin Laden was a CIA asset for a long time
Haliburton did make a fortune in Iraq since they got all the no-bid contracts
And the whole argument of the Left says this and the left says that is so stupid and really old and not many people do buy that anymore. I am not left or Right I am into Freedom through the constitution and the Bill or Rights.

I am still reading some of the stuff on that link and its absolutly funny that anyone would believe such outright lies.

I feel the same about the lies being told to you.

[lifesadream]

Do the research, investigate it. If you are going to be lazy thats your problem If you are in such a fog not to know stuff even the mainstream media has reported then you are really hopeless. Everything I have posted has been reported and backed up by numerous sources. The Taliban was put in by the US gov't, I cant believe you dont even know that, and that Bin Laden and the Bush family have been in business together since the 70' and that he was sent to Afganistan in the 80's to fight the Soviets out of that country. He and Al Qaeda were funded and trained by the US gov't , again the US gov't funded and trained Al Qaeda. Do the research, dont believe me, investigate it yourself, look at multiple sources and writings and actual documents. former CIA and FBI officials have gone public with all of this.
Have you heard of CFR,The Carlyle Group. Ever hear of PNAC? probably not. Just a group headed by high ranking members of the Bush Administration who believe in conquring the whole entire world. Read their statements on Rebuilding America's Defenses and how they describe needed a new Pearl Harbor to speed up the process and just so you know that was written in 2000 a year before sept 11,2001.

Start with-Operation Northwoods then work your way to-REX 84
That will get you started.

[Death2all]

Do the research, investigate it. If you are going to be lazy thats your problem If you are in such a fog not to know stuff even the mainstream media has reported then you are really hopeless. Everything I have posted has been reported and backed up by numerous sources. The Taliban was put in by the US gov't, I cant believe you dont even know that, and that Bin Laden and the Bush family have been in business together since the 70' and that he was sent to Afganistan in the 80's to fight the Soviets out of that country. He and Al Qaeda were funded and trained by the US gov't , again the US gov't funded and trained Al Qaeda. Do the research, dont believe me, investigate it yourself, look at multiple sources and writings and actual documents. former CIA and FBI officials have gone public with all of this.
Have you heard of CFR,The Carlyle Group. Ever hear of PNAC? probably not. Just a group headed by high ranking members of the Bush Administration who believe in conquring the whole entire world. Read their statements on Rebuilding America's Defenses and how they describe needed a new Pearl Harbor to speed up the process and just so you know that was written in 2000 a year before sept 11,2001.

Start with-Operation Northwoods then work your way to-REX 84
That will get you started.

Yes sounds like the ramblings of Michael Moore

[lifesadream]

Actually I cant stand Michael Moore. His film did open some eyes but he didnt even touch the surface. All I say is reserch it and you seem not to want to . If you trust your gov't so much look up Operation Northwoods and Rex-84.

[Death2all]

You made a good point with the whole cuban plan thing.

[Mike]

Thanks Paul. I had quit the thread thanks to retarded name calling and lack of actual discussion. And why the emphasis on lowercase "L" for libertarian?

i'm guessing because the Libertarian party is crazy. Yet libertarians are cool.

For everybody else: why can't you just discuss a point without automatically assuming the person you disagree with is all the worst stereotypes of either Democrats or Republicans? Just discuss the merits of their argument without being a jackass.

This is the internet. Sane, coherent, and cordial discussion is not permitted.

[Mike]

[
10. I don't know what fiat money is - please enlighten me.

That would be paper money. As opposed to being tied to some type of material. Like gold.
And I will laugh heartily at anyone that thinks we should return to a gold standard.

[Mike]

When I am talking about killing terrorists I mean all over the world, not just Iraq. I don't mean some ambiguous definition, I mean organized cells or groups. Hezbollah and the recent group from in the Indian train bombings included.

Hezbollah is, at least in Lebanon, a nationally-recognized political group that has something like 15 seats in the Lebanese government, has a large civilian wing that runs aspects of internal education, hospitals, and other critical parts of the social and economic strata. Are we supposed to storm Lebanon's parliament and kill these fuckers, because they have a political and boundary dispute with Israel? Because we classify them as terrorists? That's silly.

I just think you'd be better off looking deeper into the issue of who is in the business of classifying "terror" and for what reasons, instead of subscribing to the black/white good/evil school of thought.

Hezbollah is a terrorist group. They were formed with a large amount of help by Iran, to conduct guerilla operations on the IDF when they were occupying Lebanon. This was right after the Lebanon War.
Yes there is a civilian part of the party, but like you said they have only 15 seats. Very small minority, yet they control the whole government, and in turn are controlled by Iran.

[ProstheticHead12]

Thanks Paul. I had quit the thread thanks to retarded name calling and lack of actual discussion. And why the emphasis on lowercase "L" for libertarian?

i'm guessing because the Libertarian party is crazy. Yet libertarians are cool.

For everybody else: why can't you just discuss a point without automatically assuming the person you disagree with is all the worst stereotypes of either Democrats or Republicans? Just discuss the merits of their argument without being a jackass.

This is the internet. Sane, coherent, and cordial discussion is not permitted.

Sorry, for some reason I was thinking people here were educated, civil and rational.

Perhaps this is for another thread but why is the Libertarian party crazy? They were my last hope for a viable third party.

[Strangler]

WREKage-Paul wrote:
Strangler wrote:
ProstheticHead12 wrote:
Strangler wrote:
I fucking love U.S. propaganda. They will call anything a terror act but what about their invasion of Iraq? To me, U.S. is a terrorist in this situation and world is not doing shit to prevent this from happening. *clap clap*


the difference is in the motives. saddam is a proven killer. our goal was to prevent him from killing more innocent people and i think we should've bombed his ass a long time ago. the UN wasted time with a bunch of resolutions but no actions. our goal was not to disrupt and destroy iraq, but to remove saddam from power and institute a democracy. obviously we could've done a better job, but we're still there trying to create a peaceful iraq. find me a terrorist that stuck around after the bombing to help clean up. oh, wait, they're all a bunch of cowards.


No, no, no. Your goal was to get rid of those "weapons of mass destruction". Remember?



Yep. Which were reported to be in Iraq by the Brits, specifically MI-6. Unfortunately, the CIA didn't have the assets in place to verify them (Clinton can take some blame for underfunding the CIA, but it wouldn't have been easy to have agents in place even with good funding).

Why do you think Tony Blair -- who ideologically wasn't even close to Bush or the GOP, he's Labour -- has been the only global leader to fully sign on for the Iraq War? Hint: it was his intel that got us into it in the first place.


Blaming some other country for your intelligence "screw up"? I don't think it was a screw up. This was planned. Junior had to finish his father's job.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,200499,00.html

Do you really want me to start believing what that network puts out?

No WMDs were ever found in Iraq. They're here, in U.S.! I believe Israel has them too.

[Strangler]

Thanks Paul. I had quit the thread thanks to retarded name calling and lack of actual discussion. And why the emphasis on lowercase "L" for libertarian?

i'm guessing because the Libertarian party is crazy. Yet libertarians are cool.

For everybody else: why can't you just discuss a point without automatically assuming the person you disagree with is all the worst stereotypes of either Democrats or Republicans? Just discuss the merits of their argument without being a jackass.

This is the internet. Sane, coherent, and cordial discussion is not permitted.

Sorry, for some reason I was thinking people here were educated, civil and rational.

Terrorists don't respond to diplomacy. They respond to bombs. Education and intelligence and step 2. Step one is kill all the fuckers that won't think twice about killing us first. Enough Geneva Convention bullshit written for a different era. Our enemies don't wear uniforms, frequently don't represent a specific nation, and will do anything to wipe out the Great Satan and Israel. Fortunately they're ignorant and easily led. Stop their leaders and cut off intelligence (in a military sense) and we can continue to solve the problem of Islamic extremism and violent reprisals from the US and Israel.

offer me a better solution. i realize my statement was simple, but the fake redneck quote is completely unnecessary. some people just need to be taken out and that's the only way to stop them. islamic terrorist extremists are a great example. they don't want peace, they want us destroyed. until the world is an islamic state they won't be satisfied. this isn't a majority of muslims (i hope) but until muslims stand up to the extremists in their religion the violence will continue.

I just wanted to point out your stupidity. Have a great day.

[NeuroNomicon]

N. Korea has the ambition to lob nukes at its neighbors, as well as us. It's a military-dictatorship, and it's population is damned near enslaved. It is a den of the most unrighteous evil this world has to offer. If the United States really cared about the subjugated, the impoverished, and gross violations of human rights and dignity, we'd be over there fighting the good fight.

The truth be told, the United States is NOT the United States of old. We're not the great liberators anymore. We're the great panderers. The war in the Middle East is a corporate war, not a war of "liberation". If you look at the documents concerning the re-division of Iraq, and the postwar planning, it looks more like a corporate takeover than a war of decency. You'll never guess what the first thing to be taken over and reorganized? The banks! That's right, when we're done, the financial institutions of Iraq will be wholly controlled by western companies. You think the Iraqi people are going to be in control of THEIR oil when we leave? No way, Jose!

Unfortunately for the N. Korean people, they're not sitting on a honeypot of Triceratops-grease.

The truth be told, there's not a financial-incentive to raid and liberate N. Korea. In the Middle East, there is. If you can assume one thing about politicians, it is that their true constituency is cold hard cash, mixed with a dash of power. If you think your elected officials are acting on your behalf, congratulations! Politicians get where they are because they want power, and are willing to do what it takes to consolidate it.

Look into:
"Moving the Iraqi Economy from Recovery to Growth"

[NeuroNomicon]

...you know what? This whole thing is very fucking stupid. The entire Executive branch of government is comprised of "ex" Oil-Tycoons. If you don't think there is even the hint of an "agenda", contrary to what is presented publicly, you're a tool of monumental proportions.

The arguments FOR the war in Iraq are so flimsy, and so vapid as to be almost staggering. It's a blunderous clusterfuck that history will look back upon with an attitude not unlike Vietnam...