UFC buys Pride

[BlazeTSU]

the UFC has, in recent history, not "worked" or "pre-arranged" victories but have stacked the odds in favor of their posterboys(everyone has some chance in a fight). most notably, chuck liddell. no fault of his own......their just haven't been any UFC guys on that level in a while.

and as far as the grappling goes.......there really isn't much submission grappling going on these days. i mean hell, even the top grapplers in the sport have learned to bang on their feet.........ex - the nog brothers(pride), bj penn, matt hughes, georges st. pierre, ricardo arona(pride), randy couture, dan henderson....etc. the majority of the grappling that happens in modern MMA is for positions to strike. the top strikers have all become great grapplers too so there really is no room in modern MMA for a one dimensional fighter.

i for one think that grappling is awesome and a good submission is probably more exciting to me than a KO b/c there is no luck in the submission game. every submission has to be set-up and executed.......unlike KO's when someone can just shut their eyes and swing wildly and catch someone on the button. i've trained ju-jitsu for years though and that makes the whole grappling thing stand out to me.

their are a few exceptions and the UFC does have a few "blankets" that make the majority of their personal fights boring(josh koscheck, rashad evans, jake o'brien) but those are all guys that are great at takedowns and then don't know what the hell to do after they get someone down. if they actually knew how to throw some subs it would make the fights more interesting.

[egg yolkeo]

I dont see the UFC stacking the odds for anyone especially Chuck,the guy has had 17 fights in the UFC and only lost 2, both avenged and all against top world ranked fighters at the time.If anything he cleared the UFC LHW division because he is the superior fighter.There isnt one LHW/MW from pride that has shown that he could do the same thing.
Fedor is the only one that has proven to be a more dominant champion.
The UFC has had a few questionable decision scoring's but they do not protect their fighters and they always try to get the top guys to fight for the belts because they want the best,and now they own pride its great!Cant wait to see Fedor and Shogun in the cage.

[BlazeTSU]

I dont see the UFC stacking the odds for anyone especially Chuck,the guy has had 17 fights in the UFC and only lost 2, both avenged and all against top world ranked fighters at the time.If anything he cleared the UFC LHW division because he is the superior fighter.There isnt one LHW/MW from pride that has shown that he could do the same thing.
Fedor is the only one that has proven to be a more dominant champion.
The UFC has had a few questionable decision scoring's but they do not protect their fighters and they always try to get the top guys to fight for the belts because they want the best,and now they own pride its great!Cant wait to see Fedor and Shogun in the cage.

dude, you can't be serious?



if anything chuck has gotten the brunt of the UFC's favor. he hasn't fought any top ranked guys for years besides tito and randy. lets look at the people he has fought since 2003.........



Tito Ortiz(twice), Babalu, Randy Couture(twice since 2003, three fights total), Jeremy Horn and Vernon White.



ok, so thats 7 fights against 5 fighters and only two of those fighters were ever ranked in the top ten at LHW. Besides that fact, all of them except for Vernon White have been wrestlers and we all know that chuck has some of the best takedown defense in the game. Not to mention that Vernon White is probably not even ranked in the top 100 at LHW its laughable that the UFC actually signed this fight.


lets look at this fighters a little closer....


so Tito is still a threat........in a PR war. he has been lackluster for over 3 years now and aside from beating up a 43 year old Shamrock twice has only won bullshit decisions. so chuck beats him while he is still ranked pretty high back in '04 but was greatly aided by a thumb to tito's eye. and then he beats tito again while tito can barely eek out wins against guys like Patrick Cote and Forrest Griffen......whoopty doooo.


then you have Babalu. he hasn't won a fight worth mentioning since 2003 when he beat a much smaller jeremy horn and scored a win over Shogun who hadn't even been competing in MMA for a year yet. Did i mention that Chuck and Babalu had already fought and Chuck totally dominated him the first time? it wasn't too far fetched to think that Chuck was going to knock him out again.


then Randy Couture. sure, randy is great and is a legend and is a huge win in anyones record.....BUT.....he is over the hill. even with that being the case, these are chuck's two brightest marks on his resume. Randy is the only case of legitimacy to Liddell's title reign. good job Chuck.


Jeremy Horn, are you serious? the guy is a great BJJ guy but he weighs around 180 soaking wet. and sure, he beat chuck early in Chucks career but with all of Chucks fights and training since then was anyone wondering about the outcome of that one? not only does horn fight in a smaller weight class than LHW, he isn't even ranked at MW.


Vernon "the tiger" White is just laughable. his record is 25 wins, 30 loses and 2 draws. thats a sub .500 fighter who amassed this horrifying record fighting in the underling MMA promotions having only fought in PRIDE twice, both losses and the UFC twice with one loss and one draw. yet another gift from the UFC matchmakers.


the only top 10 striker that Liddell has beaten in his
entire career was allistar overeem. and for that matter, overeem was whooping chucks ass before he gassed out and took a liddell right hand that put him to sleep. Chuck was out on his feet multiple times in this fight.


i'd say that Wanderlei's reign over PRIDE was much more impressive. he fought everyone they threw his way(including some of the best HW's in the world) and went undefeated in PRIDE for almost six years. i'd say thats a lot more impressive than chucks three year reign over the dismil UFC LHW division.


and i'd say that Shogun's run is more impressive than Wanderlei's b/c he has fought the best strikers and grapplers in the world and has been dominant. not only can he outstrike his opponents but he outgrapples them as well. thus proving himself to be the top LHW in the world by leaps and bounds.


i think Chuck is a good fighter, he obviously has a great skillset BUT he has had maximum protection from the UFC. now that they are going to be putting together some mixed cards from PRIDE/UFC the UFC won't be able to protect him anymore. so i guess we'll see just how good he really is........i'm betting he falls to #5 or 6, which is still great but not the GOD the UFC has made him out to be.

sorry this is so long but it has to be long and detailed to drive the point home that Chuck Liddell isn't the GOD OF MMA.

[egg yolkeo]

Im not or never did reffer to Chuck as the god of mma and u surly dont have to try to convince me otherwise, but u just seem to try and discredit him at every turn yet make exuses for everyone else.
Babalu was on a ten run undeafeted streak after his first loss to Chuck and was ranked a top ten lhw for the rematch sorry dude, thats 3 very legit and dangerous fighters.Horn was just so he could avenge his first loss and who cares about Vernon.

Are you serious in thinking that Alistar was beating Chuck until the right?If so u really need to pay more attention,Chuck was never out on his feet either plz stop the bs.Alistar landed a couple good shots but it was Chuck
who was controlling the fight with counters,takedowns,tie ups and knees to the head before hurting Alistar with some rights and then landing the big one and finishing him off.Besides the annoucer thinking Chuck was hurt I never saw him even phased,just had a small cut on the top of his head and above the eye from the couple good shots.
This is mma so who cares about fighting top ranked strikers anyway,Chuck destroyed Alistar with strikes so thats all that matters.

Why are you so impressed with Silva's record?The guy beats a bunch of japanese cans loses to Arona but wins back a boring decision without barly throwing a punch and fights a couple HW's that are new to mma with his most impressive wins being against Rampage who has never even held a belt and Saku.Since has head his head kicked off by CC and got owned by Hendo who fights at 185.
And ah yes Shogun,lets see recent fights include,Alistar2,Randleman,decision over Nakamura oo and a loss to Coleman.
Hmm well Chuck already destroyed Randleman in his prime and pwned Overheem.He won a GP after losing to Babalu but winning a weight division belt and defending it against top guys is much more imperessive so call me when Shogun beats Hendo and defends it 7 times.

The UFC never made him out to be a god or did they ever protect him gimmie a fking break,Chuck has been with them for a long time and fought though some of the toughest competition out there to get that belt and has defended it convincinly numberous times.Pride fighters in the UFC is just going to make the competition harder for everyone because your argument works both ways

U just seem to not truly respect what Chuck has been able to do and are bent on discrediting his accomplishments while at the same time overrating Shogun and W.silva.U talk about an incidental eye poke but fail to mention Silva intentional headbutts on Mezger and holding on to the ropes while stomping,come on.Silva recent ass beatings have been a long time coming.
Fighting in pride does not somehow make u the better fighter and Im sure if Chuck had been with them for as long his record would be just as impressive despite 1 loss to Rampage over there.
Chuck is ranked #1 lhw in the world right now and Shogun is #2 and Hendo is #3 for good reason.I dont see how u think shougun is #1 until either he beats Hendo for the belt or Chuck loses.
U dont base rankings on ability or opinion they have to earn it.
But then again u are the one that says Chuck doesnt throw jabs or hooks so........

[BlazeTSU]

the UFC has, in recent history, not "worked" or "pre-arranged" victories but have stacked the odds in favor of their posterboys(everyone has some chance in a fight). most notably, chuck liddell. no fault of his own......their just haven't been any UFC guys on that level in a while..........

ok, so please tell me where i was discrediting him here? it looks like i said it wasn't his friggin fault. pointing out the fact that the UFC has done their best to make sure he keeps that belt isn't a discredit to chuck.

are you chuck's brother or cousin or babysitter or what? i like chuck, and if you look back through all my posts about the dude you'd see that i make it a point to say so. just b/c i don't lick his nutsack and give him credit where it isn't due doesn't mean i hate him.

and yeah, shogun can be #1 at LHW. he did win a grand prix by beating rampage, nogueira and arona in a 3 month time frame. for those of you keeping score at home.........thats three of the top 5 LHW fighters in the friggin world. and does it really make a shit that he broke his arm in a fluke fall against coleman? and yes, it was a fluke. please on all thats holy don't try to tell me that coleman caused the break.


and no, fighting in PRIDE alone doesn't make you a better fighter than a UFC fighter. the thing that gives every LHW and HW from PRIDE an edge over the UFC is the depth at those weight classes. when guys like arlovski and liddell blow through non ranked title contenders and get tauted as "the best in the world" its hard to swallow. especially when both of those weight classes are stacked in the PRIDE ranks and starved in the UFC. until chuck defends his title against stronger fighters he'll never be considered #1 by die hard MMA fans. PERIOD. end of fuckin argument.

[BlazeTSU]

http://forum.atlantametal.net/viewtopic ... sc&start=0


its funny how even in this old thread i had to keep reminding you that i liked chuck. you are so blinded by the fact that i don't think he is perfect that you can't seem to understand i think he is a great fighter.

i even mention in that thread how he had to work his ass off to get to the title.

its round and round with you on this issue.